The Battle of the Five Armies: Extended Edition (… speculation)

The Hobbit The Battle of the Five Armies Extended Edition logo

Seen the last Hobbit film? Want more?
Here’s what we might see in the Extended Edition


— Naturally, here be Spoilers —

If you enjoyed The Battle of the Five Armies but, like me, were not fully satisfied due to certain omissions, the content of next year’s Extended Edition seems to be extremely promising; a definitive director’s cut to be shelved along with the other 5 equally-stupendous Middle-earth films.

During the World Premier in London, Peter Jackson already stated that there will be 30 minutes of new material.

That’s an entire half an hour of scenes, ladies and gentlemen, that will hopefully “beef up” the content of Film 3: not necessarily because it is needed, but more to fuel the burning desires of us Tolkien fans for more Middle-earth!

Let’s have a look at what we missed from the trailers (and beyond), and speculate on what may be added to the extended cut …

Attack on Lake-town

In my opinion one of the best openings from any of the Middle-earth films, I wouldn’t mind a few extra scenes or shots sprinkled here and there.

Take this terrifying shot of Smaug obliterating one of Lake-town’s alleys, from the teaser trailer:

Smaug attacks Lake-town (EE)

If there’s a scene with Smaug and Lake-town, there must be a Bowman somewhere too …

Case in point, these nail-biting shots from the main trailer featuring Luke Evans’ Bard in a spot of bother!

Bard in Lake-town attack (EE)

Whether this moment occurs before or after Bard’s famous deed is up for debate. But considering he’s got his bow and arrows with him, I’m guessing it’s somewhere during the attack, whilst he’s on the bell tower…

Shores of the Long Lake

Peter Jackson gave us some breathtaking New Zealand imagery, as the survivors of Lake-Town scramble to the shore.

We also witnessed the departure of the remaining dwarves as they head back to the Lonely Mountain; and Tauriel and Legolas walking among the desperation of the stricken people.

Legolas & Tauriel with Lake-town survivors (EE)

This shot could be an extended scene of the two Elves coming to terms with the devastation before them: prior to Legolas making reference to Mount Gundabad and his intention to journey there.

Sauron in Dol Guldur

I may be wrong, but this moment – featuring a fantastic shot of Sauron ablaze on the steps of a Dol Guldur staircase – was not in the final film.

Unfortunately, what we got was a serious of epileptic-inducing flashes of Sauron’s eye.

Sauron in Dol Guldur

Was this simply a work-in-progress image before the final result? Or is there more to the Galadriel/Sauron confrontation?

I’m really rooting for the latter … look at that bad guy pose: it’s awesome!

The Guardians of the Three

In a recent interview (I believe it was the podcast by Empire Magazine), Philippa Boyens stated that there may be more focus on the Dol Guldur subplot and a more intricate look at the Guardians of the Three Rings (Elrond, Galadriel and Gandalf).

In addition, the soundtrack list to The Battle of the Five Armies includes the “Extended Version” of this  track – further hinting at a longer scene to come.

(In that same podcast, Boyens had also said Bombur could have a line or two of dialogue. But whether we should take this with a pinch of salt or not, is not certain at this point …)

Radagast’s staff exchange

It might not disrupt the viewing pleasures of the general moviegoer, but as fans we want to witness the moment Radagast hands over his staff to Gandalf.

It would have been useless if the filmmakers decided to give Gandalf a new staff for The Hobbit without making reference to how he got the one in The Lord of the Rings.

Gandalf and Radagast (behind the scenes)

There’s nothing definitive on whether this scene actually exists but from the video production diaries posted online, this behind the scenes shot hints towards that possibility (note: the scene in the image takes place after Radagast rescues Gandalf from Dol Guldur and takes him to the eaves of Mirkwood).

A Thief in the Night

Again, we can only rely on the spoken word here, but James Nesbitt had said in an interview that he and Martin Freeman shot a scene involving their characters, prior to Bilbo sneeking out of Erebor to present the Arkenstone in front of Bard and Thranduil.

Azog’s Army Marching towards Erebor

We got the whole earth-digging worms; but the scene where the Orc army marches through the newly-dug tunnels like ants was not in the final cut.

Orc army marching through tunnels (EE)

This gorgeous sweeping shot from the main trailer gives us a better glimpse of the vast extent of Azog’s army, prior to the ensuing battle.

Also, I do not remember this shot where Azog lifts both arms up as his army marches forth.

Azog army marching

I’m pretty sure this occurs some time before the orcs pass through the tunnels – since, during the battle, Azog is always on Ravenhill (with the big kite-signifier-thingy behind him).

The Dwarven Chariot Chase

This shot was perhaps one of the highlights of the teaser trailer.

Unfortunately, whilst the choreography looked promising, the CGI wizardy lacked realism (look at Balin and Kili’s stiff reactions to the chariot jolt!).

Perhaps, Peter Jackson was right to cut it out, though I doubt it was for unrealistic visual effects reasons.

Chariot Chase (EE)

Nevertheless, I’m intrigued to see how it would have played out in the narrative.

Is this soon after the Elven army’s encampment in Dale? And what might four of Thorin’s companions be doing out there in the cold?

Whether this will ultimately be included in the Extended Edition or remain as a speculative deleted scene, we’re bound to the waiting game …

Elven Arrows vs Dwarven Ballistas

The main trailer would have us believe that, at one point, the Elf and Dwarf hosts fire on each other: one relying on the sheer number of arrows in their quivers and the other on their impressive projectiles.

Placing the two shots after each other seems to imply a shared event (something known as the Kuleshov Effect in film theory, but that’s for another time).

Elves and Dwarves (EE)

I’m still hesitant whether these actually occur in the same instant. Furthermore, I doubt that the shot of the Elven army is complete (notice the lack of a Lake-town contingent amid the ranks, as clearly defined in the final film).

However, knowing Peter Jackson’s delight in making the most of a battle, I do not doubt the Dwarven Ballistas will be featured in the Extended Edition: perhaps as Troll repellents? It is a plausible possibility …

Thorin’s Justification

“Everything I did … I did for them.” 

Thorin - everything I did (EE)

Whilst these lines seem to occur moments before the Company charges out of Erebor, Thorin finds himself in a narrow corridor – rather than in the large courtyard inside the sealed front gate.

Everything in this shot (from the clothing, to Thorin’s tone of voice), seems to point towards a dwarf king who has repented of his actions and has laid aside his lust for gold.

But who might he be talking to? Will Thorin strike another conversation with Dwalin; that last of which ended rather shockingly, when he threatened to kill one of his most loyal companions?

Whatever it may be, I hope it makes the cut. Richard Armitage continues to impress with his acting skills as Thorin. Bravo!

Charge of the Dwarves

Undoubtedly, this was one of the shots that made me jump up and down with excitement after seeing the teaser trailer.

A host of dwarves charging on giant rams? Brilliant.

Dwarves on Rams charge (EE)

And it happens to be one of those scenes you immediately think about after viewing the film. Leaving you wondering what ever happened to it.

But we can almost be certain of its inclusion in the Extended Edition.

How else would you explain Thorin, Fili, Kili and Dwalin finding four such bighorned sheep amid the battlefield and riding towards Ravenhill?

Anyone thinking of the Rohirrim at the Battle of the Pelennor Fields? 😉

Charge of the Lake-town Women

I may be wrong here, but this penultimate shot from the main trailer seems to involve a furious clash between Azog’s orcs and survivors of Lake-town.

What’s more, said survivors appear to be female.

Lake-towners fighting in Dale (EE)

Yet again, it would make sense to see such a scene. At one point, we did get one of the women (can’t think of her name) proclaim to the others around her to help in repelling the Orc army.

Unfortunately, we never actually got to witness this act of pure bravery. If included in the Extended Edition, it would make the Battle that more exciting and emotional.

And  from the looks of it, it seems more gritty and visceral combat shots are in store for us.


Bilbo’s Shining Moment

More Bilbo please!

Even if it means a few precious seconds of Martin Freeman’s stellar performance, such as the case in this shot.

Bilbo in Dale (EE)

“When faced with death, what can anyone do?”

Bilbo, undoubtedly in Dale, seems to be contending with an important figure who may help tip the battle in their favour. Is it Gandalf (would he ever talk to the wizard like that), or perhaps Thranduil?

Gandalf gets Eloquent

“You have but one question to answer. How shall this day end?”

Absolutely no idea where to place this.

Gandalf - day end (EE)

Considering the lack of pointy hat, this may occur half-way through the battle.

As to who Gandalf may be talking to, is almost impossible to say at this point. But I always thought he was directing his question to one of the “good folks” (either Thranduil or Dáin).

The wizard endorses his headmastery side, as if rebuking children who are constantly bickering between themselves (Elves and Dwarves, anyone?)

Seeing how it has been featured over and over again in many TV spots, I’m guessing we’re bound to discover where this scene takes place, sometime next year.

The Company of Thorin: Battle Moments

In numerous interviews over these last three years, we’ve had both actors playing the dwarves and the filmmakers themselves speaking about each of the dwarf’s moment during the Battle.

We were told that each dwarf will get play out his To be honest, seeing the lack of any character development in the dwarves (apart from Thorin and Kili), I find it hard to understand how we could get such scenes in the Extended. Still, I’d love to see whether we will actually see these – as they would significantly elevate Film 3 position even better.

One such “moment” involved the character of Bifur. William Kircher stated that something beautiful happens in connection with his character’s inability to speak any language other than Khuzdul. It can be assumed that: either the axe in his head ceases to be stuck in his head, or he learns to speak in the Common Tongue (aka English).

It’s these promisingly-beautiful insights that would make the concluding chapter of The Hobbit an even more deserving film.

Thorin’s Funeral and Dáin’s Coronation

Two scenes that have been sorely missed.

Yet, fear not! For it seems that both sequences (at least the funeral) have been filmed and could potentially be part of the 30-minute material.

Thorin's Funeral (EE)

Take a look at this very dark image (probably from a book) of the scene in question. (Big thumbs up to for providing this image on their Facebook page here)

I’m getting excited just looking at it … and did you noticed Beorn to the extreme left of the image? And the Dwarves in the background?

Furthermore, I haven’t yet been through the Chronicles book of The Battle of the Five Armies, but apparently there’s artwork of Dáin wearing the crown of the king.

Dain's Coronation (EE)

This could be another indication that we may get a coronation scene of sorts … Where’s that pre-order button?!

Beorn’s Busting Bear

“[T]he extended cut, which will be about 30 minutes longer, will have some additional Beorn stuff”, said Peter Jackson at a press junket.

Let’s hope so.

Whilst his shape-shifting sky-diving stunt was impressive, it lasted less than 30 seconds.

For such an important character during the Battle, here’s hoping for more Beorn madness.

We also saw a bruised Beorn in the special features of the Extended Edition of The Desolation of Smaug. Does he acquire does during the Battle or was he supposed to be part of the Dol Guldur attack?

Remember the Lego sets that were released prior to each movie?

There was a set for The Desolation of Smaug by the name of “Dol Guldur Ambush”, featuring Beorn and two orcs in the ruins of Dol Guldur.

Dol Guldur Ambush (Lego Set)

Actor Mikael Persbrandt had once commented on an interrogation scene he had filmed – which was very “embarassing”.

Given the clues we’ve been given about him being captured by the orcs and chained (at the start of Film 2), could this scene originally intended for The Desolation of Smaug, find its way in the Extended Cut of Film 3?

The Troll Hoard

In the book, Bilbo’s return to the Shire isn’t complete without the finding of the buried treasure looted from the trolls’ cave.

Bilbo's returnIn An Unexpected Journey, this is confirmed by Ian Holm’s statement that it still “smells of troll”, not to mention Bofur, Nori and Gloin “making a long-term deposit”: hinting that we may yet get to watch a scene where the hobbit and the wizard unearth some of these treasures.

Furthermore, reference could be made of Bilbo’s acquisition of the orc helmets and weapons: both those hanging in his study and the ones Frodo discovers in his chest.

Towards the end of Film 3, Bilbo returns back to the Shire burdened with much memorabilia: including what looks like a dwarven shirt, his mithril shirt and several other objects.

We may yet see how the hobbit acquired these in the Extended Edition …

Release Dates

There are currently no release dates yet for the Extended Edition of The Battle of the Five Armies; however, it is safe to assume that we might be able to grab our own copy early November next year (if traditions are respected).

That said, there have been rumours that we might even get it as early as July … hurrah! 🙂

In the meantime, I’ll continue updating this post with any new information related to the Extended Edition.

If you’ve heard or read something, please share it with us in the comments below and I’ll include it in this post.

Come on, let’s finish the final Middle-earth film with a real bang! 🙂

(Copyright of images belongs to Warner Bros. Studios, MGM Studios and New Line Cinema)


166 thoughts on “The Battle of the Five Armies: Extended Edition (… speculation)

  1. I heard that there is going to be a scene were there is a new beast in the extended edition as in the movie agog said “send in the war beast.” Also I really wish to see more of the gundabad army and others. In the Hobbit battle of the five armies art book which I have, there might be a moment where gloin and thranduil have a scene alluded to legolas and gimli moment in the lord of the ring film.

    1. Hey Ted, I also heard that rumour. I always thought that Azog’s “War beasts” were the trolls marching in front of the orc army towards the remnants of Dain’s forces.

      Though I wouldn’t mind seeing something new … as long as it’s not a blinded troll on stilts (oh God please no …)

  2. My speculation (/hope) of what will be in the extended edition (including all the things you say) is this:

    1. More scenes on the Shores of the long lake – this felt a bit short, and needed more closure. Hopefully, Peter Jackson will include this in the future edition.

    2. More scenes getting to know the dwarves – for gods sake, most of the them didn’t even get their own line in the script! At the very least I would like to know SOMETHING about them

    3. Gandalf’s Vision in Palantir – according to Chronicles, this scene will be in the EE, and I think it has a pretty good chance of making the cut, which is good.

    4. More scenes in Dale – Dale for some reason felt very cool for me in BOTFA, and would be an awesome place to return to (and not just in battle scenes); scenes such as pre-battle Dale, post-battle Dale (Bard coronation), would be cool

    5. More scenes of the battle’s climax – the ending of the battle felt a bit underwhelming for me; the eagles just showed up out of nowhere and killed a few orcs, but you don’t see how that won the battle!

    6. The Coronation of Bard (of Dale) – Unfortunately, there is absolutely no evidence that this will be in the EE (looked everywhere in Chronicles), which is pretty devastating for me; it would be a pretty good ending for an interesting character. Actually I think I would be pretty pissed off if they didn’t have this, because why should we get to see the crowning of Dáin then, a character I barely even saw for 5 minutes, but not from a character that had like 30-40 minutes of screen time?!

    7. More of Dáin (other than funeral/coronation) – I’d actually like to see some scenes that reveals SOMETHING about this character!!!

    8. Alternate (fan) Thorin, Fili, and Kili death – each of their deaths were alright but a bit anti-climactic and out of place because all of the other dwarves were literally invincible to everything. Also, back when it was just 2 movies, there was no love triangle so Kili’s death must have somewhat different at one point of time (because he died next to Tauriel)

    9. Legolas’s adventures outside Mirkwood – knowing Peter Jackson’s directing style, he was bound to film a scene like this. I’m not saying it would fit narratively, but I would be surely welcome to something like this in the Ultimate Edition

    10. The feast the dwarves invite Bilbo to as he’s leaving – This scene shouldn’t be the fun and games like the dinner scene in An Unexpected Journey, but somber and sad but in a sweet sort of way

    11. Bilbo and Gandalf revisiting Beorn’s house and Rivendell – as a fan of the book, this scene would delight me, though I doubt the Beorn part will happen because you didn’t see him anywhere in the return journey. Also, how interesting would it be to see what Elrond and Gandalf would say to each other, after defeating Sauron (for the present)

    12. Perhaps Gandalf watching over Bilbo in the Shire?

    13. Alternate (fan) ending – Bilbo was standing in what remained of his house, feeling a longing for more adventure; then he put his hand in his pocket and took out his ring and stared at it for a while. Then it transitions to when theres a closeup on the ring in Bilbo’s hand in FOTR (when Gandalf insists he gives it up). Old Bilbo drops the ring and walks out the door. “I thought up an ending for my book. And he lived happily ever after, to the end of his days” “And I’m sure you will, dear friend” “Goodbye Gandalf” “Goodbye dear Bilbo”. – This ending has a few problems to it, mostly due to the fact that it’s so sudden, but still it would be a nice way to end it.

    14. 2nd Alternate (fan) ending – This conclusion to The Battle of The Five Armies would still feature Bilbo leaving and showing his return to Bag End. The ending would even feature the scene of Bilbo looking at the ring. However what differs in this ending is that there more of an emphasis on the book that Bilbo uses to write his story. We see the book filled with blank pages which then transitions to book being completed. However, instead of seeing the older Bilbo Baggins or even Frodo, the scene reveals that the one reading the book is none other then Samwise Gamgee. Sam became the owner in the book when Frodo gave it to them at the end of The Return of the King. We have a quick appearance of Samwise looking over the book which still resides in the study of Bilbo. We then see Sam working on the book which leads to the scene concluding with the Hobbit continuing his own tales of Middle Earth, and the film comes to a close by zooming out of Bilbo’s former study.

    I still do not see how Peter Jackson would be able to include all these scenes, including all the other ones the other people mentioned, in only 30 minutes. Hopefully it will be more like 40-45 minutes of extended footage (or maybe even 4hours like Richard Armitage said in an interview)

    Personally I think the Hobbit movies would be better if they were only two movies, and from what I heard, Peter Jackson had to make several reshoots/alterations of certain scenes to adjust to the three movie stretch, so hopefully in some future edition (i.e. ultimate edition) he release these scenes!

    1. Impressive list David, thanks for sharing! I pretty much agree with your points, especially Nos 2 and 8. Nine dwarves have been seriously lacking in characterisation (including Fili) and I hope we get a few more scenes of exposition. I also like the idea of an alternate death scene as I also thought it was underwhelming.

      I haven’t got any of the ‘Chronicles’ books yet but it seems they reveal some interesting scenes we’ve never seen. The Gandalf/Palantir sequence you mention seems an fascinating addition.

      1. Thanks for the praise James? And what are your thoughts about a Bard coronation scene that I wanted? Do you think people would like that or just feel it’s unnecessary? It will probably the Faramir-Eowyn wedding scene of the BOTFA – a scene that never gets in the cut but they put a lot of effort in it.

      2. Hmmm to be honest I would like to see a coronation scene, but I wonder whether it is really necessary. So long as we get a scene about the distribution of gold to the people of Lake-town, then I can consider myself satisfied. But even just a small moment were Bard is referenced as taking up his kingship would be intriguing indeed 🙂

  3. Few more exciting things what I read within this week was -1.) Beorn being imprisoned and tortured in Dol-Guldur, 2.)Alfrid’s death, and the most exciting thing was 3.) more Galadriel and Sauron’s confrontation scene.

  4. Since Thrain has been mentioned in both extended editions I think there will be a scene where Gandalf informs Thorin that he met Thrain in Dol Guldur

  5. What happens to taurial after kili dies, is she still alive or did she go back home and become some kind of Nun, why wasn’t she in the lord of the rings trilogy if she still alive ?

      1. What happens was they cut his character to drop the “middle-man” between Gandalf and Saruman. This was done as Gandalf was passing through Cardolan (scenes from start of books of Old Forest and Barrows cut from plot), where Radagast interrupted Gandalf’s journey from Gondor (presumably along the kings road) to Bree.

        …..yet again what you said was probably rhetorical 😛

      2. what has been assumed that after the events of the battle, she most likely sailed off into the undying lands like Elrond, Galadrial, Gandalf and Frodo did in The Return Of The King film.

  6. The scene I would like to see is from the book & it is where Balin & Gandalf visit Bilbo at Bag end. Perhaps they could alter the timeline & it is just before Balin goes to Moria & is implicitly saying goodbye to Bilbo. Alas there is no indication that such a scene was filmed.

    1. That would be nice to see Peter. I doubt they would have filmed it thought, considering PJ was criticised about his multiple endings in RoTK…

    1. Hey robyn, there is currently no date yet but expect an announcement in the coming weeks (and perhaps a preview scene). If they keep the usual tradition from the previous films, it’ll probably be available sometime early November.

      There were rumours it could be as early as Summer, but at this stage, I doubt it …

      1. I said it above I’ll say it below. All five previous extended Ed. Have been release in November ahead of Blackfriday. I can’t imagine this year being any different.

        Mid November

      2. You’re right iconatar. And whilst it’s great that they keep that tradition and it being close to Christmas, I still wouldn’t mind an earlier release … just saying 😀

  7. In the book The Hobbit TBOTFA Chronicles Art and Design we see more designs like:
    – Bombur pushing a stonehead over the cliff to the orcs (very last page)
    – Beorn shot with 8 arrows, carrying Thorin (page 243)
    – Beorn dropped on the ice (fell through) and fighting several orcs with Thorin in the distance (page 244)
    – The Battle at Ravenhill with flying orcs taking one of the dwarfs from their giant ram
    – rolling a giant wooden beam with chains and and pinns under control by dwarfs on rams from the hill down towards the orc army
    – the ring-world battle from perspective of Bilbo’s vision when put on the ring
    – dwarf war chariots

    And most important!!!!

    – GANDALFS VISION where Smaug leads the attack on whole middle Earth

    I hope to see this in the extended edition

  8. Is it just me, or does gandalf ruin the scene in BOTFA, when sitting with bilbo after thorins death playing with his pipe. I hate that scene.

    1. Hi Ellen! To be honest, I really found it quite a touching moment.

      It’s not meant to show Gandalf as indifferent to Thorin’s or the other’s deaths, but to show to a grieving Bilbo that there are simple and pleasurable things in life (such as pipe smoking) that are to be appreciated and why live can be so beautiful and should be lived to the full.

      Ultimately, beyond the sadness and the grief, there is still a return to your normal life, where you learn to appreciate those things you take for granted.

      At least, that’s my humble interpretation of the scene. 🙂

  9. Reblogged this on rainepagetoscript and commented:
    I’m trying not to hyperventilate with some EE spoilers posted online, which were a handful of scenes (have to commend the posters their restraint, still thanks guys. 🙂 Anyways, I’m saving for “The Hobbit” trilogy EE discs and I have a feeling this will come in a box-set just like LOTR collectors Ed. ouch, lolz. 🙂

    1. Hi raine286! Thanks for commenting and reblogging the article 🙂 To be honest, I haven’t read any spoilers regarding the EEs but it seems that many agreed it was a great improvement from the theatrical. I’m waiting till the 20th October to get my hands on the digital download … to be followed by the boxsets themselves of course 😀

      1. Now, I understood why on the regular DVD, Legolas was hanging upside down on that fell bat. Too many goodies in various versions, I wish they could stick to one goodie pack. 🙂

  10. I spent almost a week to see all the extras of this extended edition.
    And in these 30 hours of documentary and not one word about the music of Howard Shore? all previous editions of The Hobbit and Lotr there was always a separate chapter on the film by film music.
    But now nothing, absolutely nothing?
    Very very strange?

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